"Cinavia" watermark protection

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raist3001
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue May 28, 2013 1:35 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by raist3001 » Sun May 10, 2015 2:29 am

Just to confirm again....

An Oppo player (I own the Oppo 103) which does have Cinavia detection, will NOT detect Cinavia in an MKV container. Even with the latest firmware installed, Cinavia is not detected in MKV.

I have my entire BR disc library backed up to MKV and I can either stream via Ethernet, or play via an attached HDD to the Oppo, and the MKV file will play all master audio tracks without any issue.

Chetwood
Posts: 737
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2010 9:16 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by Chetwood » Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:05 am

BD standalones manufacturers are required to adhere to Cinavia by accepting the Blu-Ray license since 2012. The fact that Oppo apparently does that for BDs only and not MKVs looks like an oversight and sure as hell wouldn't update the firmware.
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mattias83
Posts: 33
Joined: Fri Mar 21, 2014 9:44 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by mattias83 » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:54 am

Chetwood wrote:BD standalones manufacturers are required to adhere to Cinavia by accepting the Blu-Ray license since 2012. The fact that Oppo apparently does that for BDs only and not MKVs looks like an oversight and sure as hell wouldn't update the firmware.
Are we certain it's an oversight? An mkv is not a blu-ray disc. Perhaps blu-ray players are required to adhere to the Cinavia standard for discs but not required to for mkvs or other file types since they're not a blu-ray disc format?

Krawk
Posts: 146
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2015 12:10 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by Krawk » Wed Sep 30, 2015 10:38 pm

setarip_old wrote:Here's a link to a reliable (from the publishers of DVDFab, etc.) current list of Blu-ray discs that contain "Cinavia" watermarking, as well as a list of known standalone players that contain "Cinavia" protection:

http://forum.dvdfab.com/showthread.php? ... #post46933





Updated link:
http://blog.dvdfab.cn/cinavia-protection.html

Krawk
Posts: 146
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2015 12:10 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by Krawk » Wed Dec 23, 2015 11:33 pm

DVDFab is now claiming to have "cracked the code" with regards to Cinavia.
I show some skepticism though because they have to "patch" each disc one at a time and apparently your online network connection goes haywire while doing so. like it is downloading a huge amoutn of data. Maybe it is downloading just the Cinavia portion of the audio and the program is cancelling it out? Also apparently you end up with an LPCM audio instead of a DTS or Dolby lossless format, and the LPCM file is bigger than the source file. If HDS-HD MA or Dolby TrueHD are lossless, why would this be?

Krawk
Posts: 146
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2015 12:10 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by Krawk » Sat Jan 02, 2016 12:22 am

Adding more to the topic as it may be relevant.

They say Cinavia is in the audible range. They say if you have a Cinavia compliant camcorder and try to record a movie in the movie theater, it too will shut down after 20 seconds.

If Cinavia is in the audible range, what does it sound like? Is it ruining our lossless audio experience? I say yes to this.

Are they just simple digital notches in the waveforms and a waveform filter could sort of clean it up, like a capacitor does on a noisy DC voltage line?

Wondercow
Posts: 25
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:33 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by Wondercow » Thu Jan 07, 2016 8:54 pm

Krawk wrote:Also apparently you end up with an LPCM audio instead of a DTS or Dolby lossless format, and the LPCM file is bigger than the source file. If HDS-HD MA or Dolby TrueHD are lossless, why would this be?
Because lossless does not mean uncompressed.

Meister_Proper
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2016 8:27 pm

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by Meister_Proper » Sun Mar 20, 2016 1:35 pm

mattias83 wrote:
Chetwood wrote:BD standalones manufacturers are required to adhere to Cinavia by accepting the Blu-Ray license since 2012. The fact that Oppo apparently does that for BDs only and not MKVs looks like an oversight and sure as hell wouldn't update the firmware.
Are we certain it's an oversight? An mkv is not a blu-ray disc. Perhaps blu-ray players are required to adhere to the Cinavia standard for discs but not required to for mkvs or other file types since they're not a blu-ray disc format?
Cinavia needs to be implemented in the BD stack. Oppo has two playback engines: One for full BDs and another one for files like mkv.

stonesfan129
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 5:59 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by stonesfan129 » Thu Jun 23, 2016 6:04 am

The only way to beat it is to use something that doesn't recognize the watermark.

whatever_gong82
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2009 1:30 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by whatever_gong82 » Mon Jul 04, 2016 10:10 pm

stonesfan129 wrote:The only way to beat it is to use something that doesn't recognize the watermark.
If anyone is lucky, have a copy of PowerDVD 9-11 Ultra available on your system. Those versions don't look for Cinavia.

Basically from PowerDVD 12 on, Cyberlink has PowerDVD have a check for the Cinavia signal, so you need something to play your Cinavia backups without cutting off your audio, just like the examples I posted above.

I almost forgot: later versions of PowerDVD 10 (that upgrades to PowerDVD 11/12) and PowerDVD 11 had Cinavia added to them, so you have to check to see what version you have, and whether you can downgrade to an earlier version that doesn't detect Cinavia.

richdmoore
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:13 pm

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by richdmoore » Thu Aug 04, 2016 2:04 am

DADFAB is now selling a feature that removes Cinavia from bluray movies.

http://www.dvdfab.cn/cinaviaremoval-hd-for-mac.htm

I see that they are converting the audio in the process to LPCM 5.1, but I don't know to much about it.

EDIT: I read more on the dvdfab forums. It looks like the protection removal is only for Bluray, not DVD Cinavia currently. In addition, movie titles are added on a disc by disc basis so it is not a universal solution for all cinavia titles. They have a list in the forums of at the titles they can remove.

Finally, I missed a discount in January to upgrade to the new feature for 1/2 off, as I already purchased a all in one license years ago, so I would have to pay full price ($70) now. :-(

boe_d
Posts: 67
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 5:58 pm

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by boe_d » Sun Jan 15, 2017 1:04 am

raist3001 wrote:Just to confirm again....

An Oppo player (I own the Oppo 103) which does have Cinavia detection, will NOT detect Cinavia in an MKV container. Even with the latest firmware installed, Cinavia is not detected in MKV.

I have my entire BR disc library backed up to MKV and I can either stream via Ethernet, or play via an attached HDD to the Oppo, and the MKV file will play all master audio tracks without any issue.
I have the 203 and the 103. The 103 didn't detect the Cinavia on Inferno (converted with the newest MakeMKV 1.10.4) but the 203 does.

TheShoe
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2012 4:37 pm

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by TheShoe » Mon Jan 23, 2017 3:31 pm

boe_d wrote:
raist3001 wrote:Just to confirm again....

An Oppo player (I own the Oppo 103) which does have Cinavia detection, will NOT detect Cinavia in an MKV container. Even with the latest firmware installed, Cinavia is not detected in MKV.

I have my entire BR disc library backed up to MKV and I can either stream via Ethernet, or play via an attached HDD to the Oppo, and the MKV file will play all master audio tracks without any issue.
I have the 203 and the 103. The 103 didn't detect the Cinavia on Inferno (converted with the newest MakeMKV 1.10.4) but the 203 does.
do you know if the 203 will enforce Cinavia if you feed the MKV from an external device (e.g. HTPC) to the HDMI input of the 203 rather than direct playback of an MKV on the 203?

EDIT: may have found the answer:

"Cinavia is more strictly enforced, applying to USB hard drives and DLNA, SMB and NFS networking, as well as optical discs as before (it is not detected over the HDMI input last time I checked, nor over HDMI ARC, but that could change)"

from: http://watershade.net/wmcclain/UDP-203-faq.html

So for those of us using the HDMI input of the oppo players (so far) we are ok. It does not surprise me that they have started enforce this.

Krawk
Posts: 146
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2015 12:10 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by Krawk » Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:26 am

There are now dvds out there that have Cinavia as well. This will never go away. There needs to be a Universal crack somewhere.

bambam10
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2017 10:06 am

Re: "Cinavia" watermark protection

Post by bambam10 » Tue Aug 08, 2017 10:17 am

I can confirm Cinavia annoyingly works on WinDVD Pro 11 For Windows 8 when using Disk, I had the little Grey Screen pop up a couple of times saying I was playing the Disc on an unauthorised device. I can also confirm it doesn't work on a Sumvision Cyclone V.2.0 Media Player with the film converted to MKV.
The movie in Question was called 'The Shack". And was a Commercial Disc.

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