Solved: How to view individual cells/VOB IDs/segment maps

Everything related to MakeMKV
Post Reply
Daney
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2016 2:35 pm

Solved: How to view individual cells/VOB IDs/segment maps

Post by Daney » Mon Feb 15, 2016 2:39 pm

Hello,

a DVD has the following 2 angles for the same title:

Title information
Source title ID: 8
Angle: 1
Duration: 0:06:23
Chapters count: 1
Size: 320.1 MB
Segment count: 9
Segment map: 1,2,4,5,7,8,10,11,13-14
File name: title09.mkv

Title information
Source title ID: 8
Angle: 2
Duration: 0:06:23
Chapters count: 1
Size: 320.1 MB
Segment count: 9
Segment map: 1,3,4,6,7,9,10,12,13-14
File name: title10.mkv

Is there any way or another tool to view/compare the individual segment maps? So I can figure out the exact differences between the 2 angles.

Thank you!
Last edited by Daney on Mon Feb 15, 2016 9:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ant93
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2014 9:06 am

Re: How to view individual DVD segment maps?

Post by Ant93 » Mon Feb 15, 2016 3:49 pm

There is no software I know of that can do this (although someone else may know!), however the first angle is likley to be the original title and the second angle is quite often the same title but with alternative CGI effects or something like that!

Daney
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2016 2:35 pm

Re: How to view individual DVD segment maps?

Post by Daney » Mon Feb 15, 2016 4:44 pm

In this case the resulting files have identical sizes to the bit. Also all the tracks (video, audio, subs) inside the 2 mkv files are identical.

So I guess the varying segment maps are just copies of each other, for some unknown purpose in e.g. the DVD flow logic.

Woodstock
Posts: 7492
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2011 11:21 pm

Re: How to view individual DVD segment maps?

Post by Woodstock » Mon Feb 15, 2016 5:32 pm

Often, differences like you are seeing are substitution of a different language title/credit segment.

Disney animated features usually have 2 or 3 languages available, and the only difference between the features are language-specific titles and credits.

When in doubt, I rip them all, and sort it out with VLC afterward.

There may be a way to have the MakeMKV console program output the segment maps... but I don't know how to do that.
How to aid in finding the answer to your problem: https://www.makemkv.com/faq/item/8

Daney
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2016 2:35 pm

How to view individual DVD segment maps?

Post by Daney » Mon Feb 15, 2016 7:01 pm

OK, I played the DVD and noticed if you change the audio language using the DVD menu, an additional casting credits segment is shown after the normal credits. This is not included in the resulting mkv however, as they're both identical.

For another title in the same DVD (which includes multiple short Disney films), I noticed that both the short film name in the beginning and part of the ending credits are replaced and shown in the language corresponding to the audio language instead. This change is also included in the mkv.

Edit: OK so the segment map is also known as VOB ID (or cell). I will use cell from know on. With IfoEdit you can see the timestamps where different angles are used ("Pos:" shows the ending time for each cell).

So after checking the timestamps, it is clear that the different cells for both 2 angles (languages) were created for parts where there is visible English text in the video (titles, signs etc), but in this title they were never utilized: the cell pairs such as 5&6 are duplicates, which just wastes some space. The DVD authors probably ran out of time and didn't translate cells of the Angle 2.

mgutt
Posts: 127
Joined: Sun May 05, 2019 6:38 pm

Re: Solved: How to view individual cells/VOB IDs/segment maps

Post by mgutt » Sun Dec 08, 2019 11:03 pm

As the main question is still open I jump into this discussion.

I have a dvd with two angles as follows:
Title information
Source title ID: 01
Angle: 1
Duration: 1:55:18
Chapters count: 14
Size: 5.7 GB
Segment count: 4
Segment map: 5,6,8-23,24
File name: title_00.mkv
Title information
Source title ID: 01
Angle: 2
Duration: 1:55:18
Chapters count: 14
Size: 5.7 GB
Segment count: 4
Segment map: 5,7,8-23,25
File name: title_01.mkv
As you can see it differs only between segments "6" and "7" and at the end between "24" and "25".

Opening the DVD in manual mode returns the following:
Disc Information
Label : 8BELOW_D4#23C6
Titles count : 21

Title information
1: 1/1 - 15 chapter(s) 1:55:32 26 cell(s)
2: 1/2 - 1 chapter(s) 0:00:01 1 cell(s)
3: 2/1 - 2 chapter(s) 0:00:11 2 cell(s)
4: 2/2 - 2 chapter(s) 0:00:11 2 cell(s)
5: 2/3 - 2 chapter(s) 0:00:11 2 cell(s)
6: 2/4 - 2 chapter(s) 0:00:11 2 cell(s)
7: 2/5 - 2 chapter(s) 0:00:11 2 cell(s)
8: 2/6 - 2 chapter(s) 0:00:06 2 cell(s)
9: 2/7 - 4 chapter(s) 0:00:16 4 cell(s)
10: 2/8 - 3 chapter(s) 0:00:11 3 cell(s)
11: 3/1 - 9 chapter(s) 0:09:54 15 cell(s)
12: 3/2 - 8 chapter(s) 0:09:49 14 cell(s)
13: 3/3 - 8 chapter(s) 0:09:49 14 cell(s)
14: 4/1 - 2 chapter(s) 0:10:44 2 cell(s)
15: 5/1 - 2 chapter(s) 0:01:30 2 cell(s)
16: 5/2 - 2 chapter(s) 0:04:39 2 cell(s)
17: 5/3 - 2 chapter(s) 0:01:19 2 cell(s)
18: 5/4 - 2 chapter(s) 0:01:17 2 cell(s)
19: 5/5 - 2 chapter(s) 0:00:51 2 cell(s)
20: 5/6 - 6 chapter(s) 0:09:32 6 cell(s)
21: 1/3 - 1 chapter(s) 0:00:01 2 cell(s)
This was not really helpful for me ^^ So I created MKVs of both angles and compared the intro and outro through VLC. I was not able to find the difference. So I tried to find out how to export the parts "6" and "7" to compare only those parts. Finally I found "IfoEdit" which is able to split DVD VOBs by cells.

In the first step I used DVDFab to create an ISO of the DVD. Then I opened the "VTS_01_0.IFO" in this app, clicked in the tree on "H:\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_0.IFO" and used the copy2clipboard Button to get this:

Code: Select all

   	PGC_1 (program chain): [Title(TTN): 1] [01:55:32.02 / 25 fps] (Programs: 15) (Cells: 26) (uses VOB-IDs: 2,1,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11)		
   	  [Ch 01] [Pg 01] [Cell 01] [V/C Id:  2/ 1]          : time: 00:00:00.14 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:00:00.14] [Frames: 14] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]		
   	                  [Cell 02] [V/C Id:  1/ 1] Layer Br.: time: 00:00:00.10 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:00:00.24] [Frames: 24] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]		
   	                  [Cell 03] [V/C Id:  3/ 1] Layer Br.: time: 00:00:00.14 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:00:01.13] [Frames: 38] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]		
   	                  [Cell 04] [V/C Id:  4/ 1] Layer Br.: time: 00:00:00.14 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:00:02.02] [Frames: 52] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]		
   	                  [Cell 05] [V/C Id:  5/ 1] Layer Br.: time: 00:00:28.20 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:00:30.22] [Frames: 772] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[ no/ no/yes/ no]		
   	                  [Cell 06] [V/C Id:  6/ 1] (Angle 1): time: 00:01:18.24 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:01:49.21] [Frames: 2746] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/yes/yes/yes]		
   	                  [Cell 07] [V/C Id:  7/ 1] (Angle 2): time: 00:01:18.24 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:01:49.21] [Frames: 2746] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/yes/yes/yes]		
   	                  [Cell 08] [V/C Id:  8/ 1]          : time: 00:02:24.10 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:04:14.06] [Frames: 6356] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/yes/ no]		
   	  [Ch 02] [Pg 02] [Cell 09] [V/C Id:  8/ 2]          : time: 00:10:09.12 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:14:23.18] [Frames: 21593] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 03] [Pg 03] [Cell 10] [V/C Id:  8/ 3]          : time: 00:07:36.21 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:22:00.14] [Frames: 33014] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 04] [Pg 04] [Cell 11] [V/C Id:  8/ 4]          : time: 00:06:58.03 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:28:58.17] [Frames: 43467] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 05] [Pg 05] [Cell 12] [V/C Id:  8/ 5]          : time: 00:09:18.22 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:38:17.14] [Frames: 57439] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 06] [Pg 06] [Cell 13] [V/C Id:  8/ 6]          : time: 00:13:59.19 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:52:17.08] [Frames: 78433] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 07] [Pg 07] [Cell 14] [V/C Id:  8/ 7]          : time: 00:06:52.15 / 25 fps     [Pos: 00:59:09.23] [Frames: 88748] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 08] [Pg 08] [Cell 15] [V/C Id:  8/ 8]          : time: 00:05:09.23 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:04:19.21] [Frames: 96496] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 09] [Pg 09] [Cell 16] [V/C Id:  8/ 9]          : time: 00:00:31.10 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:04:51.06] [Frames: 97281] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	                  [Cell 17] [V/C Id:  8/10]          : time: 00:11:19.08 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:16:10.14] [Frames: 114264] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 10] [Pg 10] [Cell 18] [V/C Id:  8/11]          : time: 00:08:49.01 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:24:59.15] [Frames: 127490] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 11] [Pg 11] [Cell 19] [V/C Id:  8/12]          : time: 00:09:01.09 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:34:00.24] [Frames: 141024] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 12] [Pg 12] [Cell 20] [V/C Id:  8/13]          : time: 00:04:50.23 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:38:51.22] [Frames: 148297] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 13] [Pg 13] [Cell 21] [V/C Id:  8/14]          : time: 00:09:27.24 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:48:19.21] [Frames: 162496] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	  [Ch 14] [Pg 14] [Cell 22] [V/C Id:  8/15]          : time: 00:02:53.01 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:51:12.22] [Frames: 166822] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	                  [Cell 23] [V/C Id:  8/16]          : time: 00:00:01.05 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:51:14.02] [Frames: 166852] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/ no/ no]		
   	                  [Cell 24] [V/C Id:  9/ 1] (Angle 1): time: 00:04:16.00 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:55:30.02] [Frames: 173252] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/yes/yes/yes]		
   	                  [Cell 25] [V/C Id: 10/ 1] (Angle 2): time: 00:04:16.00 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:55:30.02] [Frames: 173252] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/yes/yes/yes]		
   	  [Ch 15] [Pg 15] [Cell 26] [V/C Id: 11/ 1]          : time: 00:00:02.00 / 25 fps     [Pos: 01:55:32.02] [Frames: 173302] SP/ILVU/DISC/SA:[yes/ no/yes/ no]		
As you can see it shows the cells 6 and 7 as two different angles. The "pos" shows the timestamp. So the change must be between position 00:30.22 and 01:49:21. Again I viewed the two MKVs in VLC and then I finally saw it. They perfectly inserted an additional "In association" intro text with the same font, same fading etc displaying a german company name. I feel so dump ^^

So IfoEdit helps to identify the exact timestamps containing the changes.

But the main question was, how to view those segments and not only to determine the timestamps. And finally I found it out by using MakeMKV alone:
- At first determine the title with the multiple angles and the cells that differ. For me its the first title with a length of 1:55:32 and cell "6" and "7" are the relevant cells.
- Open MakeMKV and select the manual mode:
2019-12-08 23_50_43.jpg
2019-12-08 23_50_43.jpg (7.54 KiB) Viewed 2943 times
- Then enter the correct syntax into the field. For me its:

Code: Select all

1:@6
2019-12-09 00_05_37.jpg
2019-12-09 00_05_37.jpg (48.45 KiB) Viewed 2941 times
This means MakeMKV should select only cell 6 in title 1
- Press "OK" and tada.. it returns both angles of this cell only:
2019-12-08 23_57_01.jpg
2019-12-08 23_57_01.jpg (7.26 KiB) Viewed 2943 times
- Finally create the MKVs of those titles and now you are are able to compare only this two segments.

P.S. For this DVD angle 2 contained the german company name. Angle 1 was the international version without the change.

Grauhaar
Posts: 566
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:46 pm

Re: Solved: How to view individual cells/VOB IDs/segment maps

Post by Grauhaar » Mon Dec 09, 2019 7:21 am

Good work, good no know :D
Good Luck :)
_____________________________________________________________
Useful MakeMKV links: FAQs - Debug Log - Buy - Expiration of beta key
Two Blu-ray (UHD) Drives LG LG BH16NS55 with Libredrive Firmware 1.04

Post Reply