Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Discussion of advanced MakeMKV functionality, expert mode, conversion profiles
dancjodanc
Posts: 22
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:03 pm

Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by dancjodanc » Sun May 12, 2019 8:12 pm

I would use handbreak...but I"m dealing with 4k movies...and Atmos, and DTS:X. So, I guess I just have to select the subtitle track when needed....? I have MKVToolNix...but your saying that won't do this...hard encode the subtitle track?

Grauhaar
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Grauhaar » Mon May 13, 2019 5:27 am

Some players respects the "Forced" flag in the MKV header and selects the tracks automaticlay. You can check with MKVToolNIX if this flag is set or set it if not set.

Hardcode (Brun-in) Subtitles can only be done with Handbrake, MKVToolNIX does not change the tracks, it can only add/remove/reorder tracks in the MKV file.

I don't like Burn-In, because it is a ultimate irreversible solution. If you what to see other subtitles, the "Burn-in" sub are always there, the other sub track overlays it and this can result in bad reading.
Good Luck :)
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lixee
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by lixee » Tue Jul 07, 2020 7:20 pm

audioguy wrote:
Sat Jan 19, 2019 7:02 pm
I'm still confused on the sub-title subject. What I want is for any movie where there is a foreign language spoken AND the movie contains an English sub title track, to display that track. I have been ONLY checking the box I indicate in the attached but not the one above it that says SubTitles PGS English. Is that the correct method or do I need to check both boxes.

Image
Just to be sure: If I select "Subtitles PGS English" AND "Subtitles PGS English (forced only)" then I will get all English subtitles which are available on the disk (only regular or only forced or both)? In case both types are available I should be able to choose between two subtitle tracks when playing the mkv, one which is regular and one which is forced only?

Woodstock
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Woodstock » Tue Jul 07, 2020 8:18 pm

If you select both, you will almost certainly end up with ONE track, as the "forced only" track will be deleted as empty. This is because use of forced subtitle flags are rare.

I know of one movie (Avatar) that does it; I've heard of a couple of others. The usual scheme is that there are two tracks for each language on a dubbed disk. One contains all dialog, and is intended for use with the original language sound track. The other contains only "signs and foreign audio", the so-called "forced" subtitles, intended for use with the dubbed language sound track.
How to aid in finding the answer to your problem: https://www.makemkv.com/faq/item/8

lixee
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:09 pm

Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by lixee » Wed Jul 08, 2020 10:50 am

Woodstock wrote:
Tue Jul 07, 2020 8:18 pm
If you select both, you will almost certainly end up with ONE track, as the "forced only" track will be deleted as empty. This is because use of forced subtitle flags are rare.

I know of one movie (Avatar) that does it; I've heard of a couple of others. The usual scheme is that there are two tracks for each language on a dubbed disk. One contains all dialog, and is intended for use with the original language sound track. The other contains only "signs and foreign audio", the so-called "forced" subtitles, intended for use with the dubbed language sound track.
So at least I should always get the regular one? Is there any reason to only select the first entry and not the forced one as well?

Woodstock
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Woodstock » Wed Jul 08, 2020 3:02 pm

It is fine to leave both checked - I do it all the time. My selection rule is "all tracks", no language filter (sometimes tracks are mislabeled).

The worst thing that will happen is seeing messages about the empty subtitle track being removed. And, if you happen to find a movie that uses forced flags, you will get them.
How to aid in finding the answer to your problem: https://www.makemkv.com/faq/item/8

phileeny
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:31 pm

Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by phileeny » Thu Aug 13, 2020 8:49 am

I've been reading all the above with interest as the forced subtitles issue has bugged me for a long time.
My setting is the following [-sel:all,+sel:all,-sel:mvcvideo,=100:all,-10:favlang] I don't know what it all means I just wanted makemkv to just select everything and I would find the right subs later, if anyone has a better option I would love to see it.
What gets me is if I put a Blu-ray 4K or not in my Blu-ray player, my default language is set to English, I go in to the menu look at the audio options (mostly the default is right) them sit back and watch, the film plays in my default language and the forced subs show in my default language.
So my Blu-ray player talks to the disc so it knows what language to play and any forced subs when needed, what is the player asking that most ripping software isn't, surly ripping software should know to select the default language and the correct forced subs.
Or am I missing something.

Woodstock
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Woodstock » Thu Aug 13, 2020 1:04 pm

In an ideal world, you could add "eng" to the selection rules, and get only the English audio/subtitle tracks. But, this is not a perfect world.

I have encountered disks where you can select English in the menu, but there are no tracks tagged as "English". The menu just selects a track number and has its own label assigned to it.

So I use a similar selection rule to yours, and have MakeMKV pull EVERYTHING. It's less frustration, in my opinion.
How to aid in finding the answer to your problem: https://www.makemkv.com/faq/item/8

Chetwood
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Chetwood » Fri Aug 14, 2020 5:28 am

-sel:all,+sel:(deu|eng|nolang),-sel:(core),-10:(forced*(eng)),-15:(deu),-20:(forced*(deu))

pretty reliably gets me only English and German audio and subs.
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Kurmo
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Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2020 12:38 pm

Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Kurmo » Mon Sep 14, 2020 12:59 pm

Hello.

-sel:all,+sel:(deu|eng|nolang),-sel:(core),-10:(forced*(eng)),-15:(deu),-20:(forced*(deu))

Works fine, could someone please tell me how i disable the subs though?

Woodstock
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Woodstock » Mon Sep 14, 2020 1:15 pm

"Disable" as in not selecting any, or as in telling the player to not display them by default?

In the profiles that come with MakeMKV, no flags are set for subtitles, so the player is free to do whatever it wants. You can use modified profiles to set certain flags, but... the player is STILL free to do whatever it wants.
How to aid in finding the answer to your problem: https://www.makemkv.com/faq/item/8

Kurmo
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Kurmo » Mon Sep 14, 2020 2:52 pm

Disable as in selecting none.

Chetwood
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Chetwood » Mon Sep 14, 2020 8:03 pm

-sel:subtitle&(all)

or something?
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Kurmo
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Re: Forced Subtitle Only Selection Rule

Post by Kurmo » Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:05 pm

Thanks a lot!

For everyone wanting just german and english with no subs:

-sel:all,+sel:(deu|eng|nolang),-sel:(core),-10:(forced*(eng)),-15:(deu),-20:(forced*(deu)),-sel:subtitle&(all)

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